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Topic: running rough  (Read 4399 times)

Candace

running rough

« on: December 11, 2004, 02:36:13 PM »
My bus is running rough. I sorta think it's got something to do with the cold weather. But I know that can't be the entire problem. It sounds like it's missing. The spark plugs were replaced three months ago when I had a tuneup. Today, I replaced the spark plug wires, and I think that helped. It at least started up easily and didn't sound like it was going to die in idle. I haven't driven it across town yet since I replaced the wires, but I can tell it's still not terribly smooth. Ya'll have any other ideers? Is it possible the spark plugs need replacing after only three months? What else might it be? I'll let ya'll know how it does on the road with the new wires.
One fella told me I'm missing some sort of hoses that make the engine warmer. There are three hoses that he said are supposed to be connected by a hose/joint, but that joint isn't there. The holes for them are, one in the lower left corner, one in the upper right corner and one in the lower right, but they're just open hoses. Ya'll know what he might be talking about and if it's legit/important/a problem? AND does anyone have a recommendation for local parts? A store you can walk into and they will likely have VW parts? I don't mind online business for interior and accessories, but when I need a part, I wanna GO GET IT.
One more question....when I change the oil, should I put a different grade in for the winter? If so, what?

Offline Zen

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running rough

« Reply #1 on: December 11, 2004, 06:39:50 PM »
The problem with most old buses is that too many shade tree mechanics (like myself) have worked on them over the years.  Sometimes we get the bright idea that we can squeeze out another mile per gallon or a couple of extra horsepower if we bypass, remove, or modify one or more of the systems that VW spent decades of research and trials to develop.  From time to time we may actually get that extra mileage or horsepower, but there is almost always a price to pay for it.  A "trick" that will get you an extra couple of horsepower when it's 75 degrees at sea level might cause you to have to walk when it's 30 degrees in the mountains.

In what many people consider the Air Cooled VW Bible, "How to Keep your Volkswagen Alive, a Manual of Step by Step Instructions for the Complete Idiot," John Muir advise us to remove the choke and just roll and smoke a cigarette while you are waiting for the engine to warm up.  I've been told that John Muir lived in the desert and died of lung cancer.  Instead of listening to Mr. Muir, consult a good VW manual, or better yet, a good, experienced VW mechanic (a.k.a. Ret.Bugtech  :thumbs-up: ) and learn how optimize your engine for cold weather.

As for local parts stores that carry lots of air-cooled parts, you don't have many options.  Mainly Foreign on Rossville Blvd. is about it for Chattanooga.  They carry lots of common air-cooled parts, but they are VERY PROUD of them and depending on who waits on you, their customer service can su . . . ummm,  . . . stink.  In Cleveland there is Joe Kirtpatrick's store, Tri-State Imports.  His prices are a better than Mainly Foreign and his customer is better.  There is a store in Dalton, GA that I've heard people say is very good, but I can't remember it's name.  Also in Dalton, I've bought several parts from Al Johnson's VW (Yes, A Real VW Dealership).  Believe it or not, the last time I needed a carburetor, Al Johnson's had it IN STOCK and cheaper than either Mainly or Tri-State . . . A LOT cheaper than Mainly.  In fact, AFTER TAX they were still over $10 cheaper than Mainly's PRE-TAX price.

On the oil . . . I've seen this question explode into an all out war on other forums.  Personally, I use either Havoline or Castrol HD30 year round.  I have found that if the temperature drops below 10 degrees, you better let the engine warm up fully before you rev the engine 'cause 30 weight flows about like play doe when it's that cold.  When it's down in the single digits, you really need a "thinner" oil, but around here it isn't that cold often enough to bother with it.  Other than blowing oil out the oil cooler seals when it was 5 degrees a couple of winters ago, I've never had an oil related problem using 30 weight.  Whatever oil you choose to use, change it often.

Offline vwherb

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running rough

« Reply #2 on: December 11, 2004, 08:47:53 PM »
Something Zen didn't mention but has been talked about on other posts. Don't use ANYTHING but Bosch parts in your ignition system. Coil, points, condenser, wires, and plugs.

Offline Ret.Bugtech

running rough

« Reply #3 on: December 12, 2004, 10:58:59 AM »
AMEN !! on the Bosch Stuff.
       Zen, Don`t get me started on motor oils. :?  :lol:

Offline Zen

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running rough

« Reply #4 on: December 12, 2004, 12:08:37 PM »
Quote from: "Ret.Bugtech"
AMEN !! on the Bosch Stuff.
       Zen, Don`t get me started on motor oils. :?  :lol:


Actually, that's what I was trying to do!   :badgrin:  I'd love to hear what you have to say on the subject.  I'm sure I'd learn a thing or two . . . or three . . .

Offline Zen

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running rough

« Reply #5 on: December 15, 2004, 07:33:17 AM »
Quote from: "Ret.Bugtech"
Zen, Don`t get me started on motor oils. :?  :lol:


Actually Candice, it really doesn't matter what kind of oil you use in your bus*.  Oil is oil.  It's all slick.  Buy the cheapest stuff you can find and save yourself some money.

 :?: David, will that get you started :?:

*NOTE TO CANDICE -- Ignore this message.  I'm just trying to stir things up a bit!   \:D/

Offline Ret.Bugtech

running rough

« Reply #6 on: December 15, 2004, 10:24:20 AM »
Quote
Zen,  Boy do I have a deal for you and Candice.  I have about 7 qts of  oil that has only about 8,000 miles runing time. I think it is about 22 weight now that it has a bit of water mixed in along with some small particles of something silver looking. Its still slick though. Perfect for winter driving. FREE.


David,
That sounds like the kind of oil I used to run in my old Chevy truck!  It leaked/burned so much oil, I would "recycle" the oil I drained from my VWs through it.  It was, at one time, powered by a 307 V8.  In it's final years it was a V6.  It couldn't have been running on #4 and #6 cylinders . . . the intake valve on one and the exhaust valve on the other wouldn't open.  The cam lobes had obviously worn off.  My last trip in it, I drove to Orlando, FL to pick up a 68 convertible rust bucket I bought off of the internet.  I took two cases of oil with me . . . had to buy two more in Orlando to come back home on.  At one point I had to drive about 9 miles with no brakes to get to a parts store to buy a new brake line . . . shortly after that I was underneath it driving a bus wheel cylinder piston onto the rear univeral joint cross in place of the missing bearing cap.  Eventually, it got me home under it's own power (what little of it there was) with my rusty (and now oil soaked) convertible in tow.  It was a good old truck.  May it rest in pieces.

Back to the oil question . . . I've had good luck (so far) with 30 weight oil.  I've kind'a studied how the oil cooling circuit works on a type 1 engine and it just seemed to me that mulit-grade oil worked against the way the oil cooler was designed to work.  Like I said earlier and you mentioned too . . . 30 weight doesn't flow well when the temps are down in the teens or single digits.  I've read Bob Hoover's writtings about oil . . . most of it makes sense . . . some doesn't . . . some of it is just WAY over my head.  Like I said, I've had good luck so far with 30 weight . . . but my "so far" is just a drop in the bucket to your experiance, which is why I wanted to hear what you have to say.  I've got one 1600 single port (now in my wife's 75 convertible) that I built when I first got into VWs.  I've always ran 30 weight, and almost always Castrol or Havoline.  It's been in 4 different cars and two of them didn't have functioning odometers, so I'm only guessing, but it's probably got somewhere in the neighborhood of 90,000 to 100,000 miles on it.  It burns/leaks a little over a quart between changes.  I don't think that's too bad considering that I reused the old cylinders . . . just honed 'em and replaced the rings.  BUT . . . in the last year started having low oil pressure problems at idle when it's hot.  When I finally tear it down again, I'm really interested in seeing how much wear it has on the bearings.  In the mean time, I'll switch over to 20-50 in my other VWs.  The next time I go through an engine, I'l run it on 20-50 for about 100,000 miles and tear it down . . . so by 2015 I should be able to see for myself which works better.  Until then, I'll trust your experice.   :thumbs-up:

Offline Zen

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running rough

« Reply #7 on: December 16, 2004, 09:04:24 PM »
??? . . . I don't know what happened there!  I guess I hit "edit" instead of "quote" . . . anyway, that was me (sometime between 2 and 3 AM, which might explain the mess up).  I guess I erased David's post and put my reply along with a quote from Davids deleted post in the place of David's post that I deleted.  #-o

I worked 12 hour night shifts for almost 15 years, but I guess the last 13 years of day shifts have spoiled me.  I've worked til about 2 AM 2 days this week . . . I'm in a daze.  OK, I'm always in a daze, but now I don't even know what day it is.  I know, that's normal for me too . . .   ](*,)

Offline Zen

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running rough

« Reply #8 on: December 16, 2004, 09:07:28 PM »
David,

Sorry 'bout deletin' your post!   :blush:  Do you remember what you said?  If you don't mind saying it again, I'd like to read it after a good night's sleep . . .
 8)

Offline Ret.Bugtech

running rough

« Reply #9 on: December 17, 2004, 09:46:36 AM »
Zen, Take a break.  Way back I used 30W because that was what VW recommend. While I was in Engine school at VW, I asked my Fearless Leader why I couldn`t use a multi-grade oil and before I finished my question he wrote "economy" on the black board. The same anwser when asked about Hi-Test fuel. VW was in the "Run cheap" mode. Multi-grade oils cost more than single-grade oils at that time. I got tired of "digging" 30W oil out of my engine when the temps got down to 10 degrees and my Bug refused to turn over fast enough to start up. Seems that the weather would always catch me. 70 degrees one day, 20 degrees the next day.
  VW never said you couldn`t use multi-grade oils or hi-test fuels that I remember. Economy was the only reason. Multi-grade oils were in use in the mid 30s from Moble and Shell Oil. Mostly 10W30.
 Shell being a Dutch owned company, multi-grade oil was availble in Europe. So why didn`t VW use them ?  ECONOMY
  After the "school-house" disscusion , I changed over to 20W50 mainly because of driving "flat out" on the freeways and my hatred of changing oil everytime the weather pitched us a curve. It seemed to me that the engines ran a tad cooler and lasted longer. Really good for Van/Campers when you are "tooling" down the road trying to go 80mph @ 5500 rpms or more(oooooh !!! ) for 500 miles.
   If you choose to use a multi-grade oil, I wouldn`t use anything less than 20W50. I have used it in every VW I have owned with no problems at all.
   Im not going to get into a disscusion why multi-grade oils do what they do. Ask Bob Hoover. Im sure he will have a chemical/formula break down on the subject. I don`t have the time to worry about that. I just know it works for me.
  Its your Coal Truck. Do what you will with it.
  Zen, If you make me do this again, I`ll see that Santa will not come to your house :santa:  :lol:

Offline Russ

running rough

« Reply #10 on: December 17, 2004, 10:34:02 AM »
So, quaker state is okay to use in mine?

Offline vwherb

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running rough

« Reply #11 on: December 17, 2004, 03:12:13 PM »
Russ..........I can't believe you would ask that question.  Either the Godfather hasn't seen this or he has and has fallen over from a heart attack.

Offline Ret.Bugtech

running rough

« Reply #12 on: December 18, 2004, 12:13:18 PM »
Russ, Quaker State Oil makes a wonderful hand soap. Go ahead and use it in your engine if you want it to look like it has distemper when you take the oil filler cap off. Its slick and thats all I can say about it. :puke:

Offline 71SuperBee

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running rough

« Reply #13 on: March 27, 2005, 07:30:22 AM »
Hey there Zen,

  American Foriegn Auto is that store here in dalton,ga.. I buy all of my parts from him. He is a great guy and there is also a shop in there with him that works on foriegn cars, saab and vw etc. Thanks

      Tell him Aaron sent ya,

    Aaron

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